Archive through July 20, 2010

Janny Wurts Chat Area: Arc 4: Sword of the Canon: Initiate's Trial: Elaira: Archive through July 20, 2010
   By Maggie on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 06:06 am: Edit Post

Chana brought up a point that got me thinking... the quote:

"My hands, my mind, and my body, are hereby given to enact the will of the Prime Matriarch, WHO'S WHOLE CAUSE IS THE GREATER GOOD OF HUMANITY"

I wonder... If the Prime Matriarch's whole cause is NOT the greater good of humanity, is the whole statement null and void? It could be a qualifier, rather than a description of the person...

That is to say that maybe the words are demanding that the Prime is dedicated to the good of humanity, rather than saying that in general, this describes the Prime.


   By Sandra Jacob on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 07:14 am: Edit Post

Hunter, if Koriani respect free will, how then explain the way they used the s'Brydion brother (can't remember his name off the top of my head) who led his men in from the sea killing the soldiers of the light when they were no longer wanting to fight under the magic of Alithiel?

And having six year old children make lifetime pledges is purely giving lip service to free will.

I had completely forgotten about Luhaine's intervention with her crystal in Ships! ::clunks self on head::

And the great waystone has been befuddled with an iyat! I LOVED that scene where Arithon sends it right back to her.


   By Hunter on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 08:10 am: Edit Post

Sandra - similar to how they used a fetch of Lysaer to invoke the Curse in Arithon. They are taking what already exists - a person's free will - and amplify it. The s'Brydion didn't need much prompting to go after the misguided minions of Lysaer.

I don't think I've seen any evidence that the power the Prime has has ever been used for the greater good of humanity (whatever that might be). The greater good of the Koriani sisterhood would seem to be a more logical explanation.

Lysaer is also doing what he does for the greater good of humanity (in his view). Arithon is doing what he's doing for the greater good of Athera, the Paravians, the clans and most likely for the greater good of humanity (and his own sanity and love of Elaira). Yet they are all doing different things for the advantage of those they like and support them and lots of not so good things to those that oppose and disagree with them. So who is right? Is there a right answer? Who decides that?

I'm really looking forward to see how the iyat in the Great Waystone is resolved. I suspect Elaira's personal spell crystal may have a part to play - and potentially Lirenda's as well...


   By Chana on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 01:05 pm: Edit Post

Lysaer's view is flawed by the curse, Arithon's isn't (thanks to Davien).
I feel like I'm stating the obvious.

Also, to clarify an earlier point: Just like the F7 will go out of their way to obtain willing consent, the Koriani would go out of their way to secure an oath of debt. Yes, it can still be considered 'free will' but is it moral/honest? The F7 truly do not wish to violate, while the Koriani are simply looking for ways to trap and manipulate.

Hunter - Would you really defend Lysaer, or the Koriani? or are you simply playing devil's advocate? :-)

One last thought- Is there a difference between the way a necromancer posseses a body and the way Morriel took over Selidie? I'm asking about the concept, not the method.


   By Hunter on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 06:17 pm: Edit Post

Lysaer's view is *inflamed* by the Curse - not *flawed*.. it uses what is there already. Lysaer's background gives the Curse the foothold it needs - what he's doing on Athera is what his family did on Amroth. He thinks he is right (as does Morriel) - the question Janny is asking is for us to understand *why* - not necessarily to agree, but to view the world through multiple lenses.